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+--- Thread: GTR range in Waukegan (/thread-989.html)
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - Dutz - 02-10-2015
(02-10-2015, 09:56 AM)BelieveIn308 Wrote:(02-08-2015, 02:06 PM)Dutz Wrote: GTR's membership is just insane.
Here are some numbers.
OnTarget has a $250 membership, you pay $10 per hour with and $20 without. You need to go 26 times at 1 hour to break even, but you get to reserve.
GTR has a $449 membership, you get 10 free hours and then pay regular price, and you get to reserve.
It is $510 annual cost for OnTarget membership with 2 visits per month and $769 for GTR
For me the distance to OnTarget is 18 miles and GTR is 11. Even figuring in gas it is $580 vs. $815
Gat Guns is 31 miles away and has no membership but does have a 10 visit pass for $17.5 hour.
McMillers is 50 miles away with $12 hour.
Summary with gas included, 26 visits for 1 hour in 1 year.
OnTarget $580.98 (reservations yes)
GTR $815.02 (reservations yes)
GatGuns $640.90 (reservations NO)
McMillers $507.39 (reservations NO)
McMillers $611.39 (all day pass per visit)
McMillers $395.39 (with Annual pass)
McMiller is $300/yr, all ranges, all day, no restrictions. $20/day...
without the 300 yd range it is $200/year...
My numbers included the gas for driving 50 miles. I used $3 per gallon at 20 MPG
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - BelieveIn308 - 02-10-2015
(02-08-2015, 05:36 PM)fromtheplaines Wrote: They are a gun range, they help teach a ton if people about guns. How can they be anti second? They can't gaurntee a clear line when it comes to changing targets if there is cc allowed. That is why it's not allowed.
Nonsense. Cops carry guns. Is a firing line clear if their weapons are holstered? I know of no other range that has such a 'rule'. They should treat holstered CC as cased weapons. This is just more evidence that the range is clueless about safety.
In my two trips to this range I saw enough. Bad RSO's and bad rules. Serious shooters should avoid this range. They are the very definition of range Nazi'.
In short, SPEND your hard earned money elsewhere.
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - mikereddot - 02-14-2015
I'm in no way defending Bristol. But the reason they make the decisions they do is based on a decisions made in board room and not a on the range. A bunch of guys that make that call are sitting around a table, and it seems to make sense. Because these guys are not the ones that are one the range at the time that that "one" idiot does show up, they want to cover all their basis. If you do go to Bristol, ask an RO if they can show you the shots in the baffles when some guys AR went full auto. In this case it wasn't an idot, but a defective firearm in the hands of someone not trained correctly.
Again, just explaining why the decisions were made. I personally don't agree with it. I'm on board with making sure the range is safe for that "one" moron to use, that way the rest of us can have fun.
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - Freedoms1791 - 02-14-2015
Decisions made like that from a gun range with a long history of guns Is just what the Anti gun & anti 2A are looking for no matter what the reason the range is using for their rule they are giving the Anti's more ammo by confirming that large capacity magazine and CC is unsafe who better in the know then a gun range right. Safety should be the most important part of any range but rules like this is not how it's done. You need well trained RO's that are all on the same page and follow the most up to date training that's out there and not what there 60 years of shooting has taught them. I've seen this more than once ask two RO's about a range rule and you will most likely get two difference answer and neither one will be the actual range rule. We as members or non members also need to police are self and the range when you see something that look unsafe go to the RO if he can't resolve it go to the next RO and the next if that's what it takes to make it safe. But range Safety is not done behind closed door with a bunch of guys making up rules that can affect all of us. That's just the way I see it.
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - mikereddot - 02-14-2015
That's what you get when you mix politics in any organization.
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - Freedoms1791 - 02-14-2015
(02-14-2015, 07:45 PM)mikereddot Wrote: That's what you get when you mix politics in any organization.Yep
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - BelieveIn308 - 02-15-2015
The RSO's at Bristol are clueless, arrogant, and unfriendly, period. This is my opinion, and it will not change. Bad rules, enforced by Nazi'.
And I am sorry, but telling me their range is unsafe, and that is why the rule exists, does not make it right.
I stand by my opinion, GO ELSEWHERE, don't spend a dime there, and ENCOURAGE everyone you know to AVOID it, if the value the Second Amendment.
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - fromtheplaines - 02-15-2015
(02-10-2015, 12:44 AM)Freedoms1791 Wrote:(02-10-2015, 12:27 AM)fromtheplaines Wrote:So by using the one bullet rule? the one bullet won't hit the farmer's barn or it's OK to hit the farmer's barn one bullet at a time? I would think if Bristol is all about safety and rules I think even hitting the farmer's barn one time is to many. One bullet rule is for safety I don't think so there more to it.(02-09-2015, 03:59 PM)BelieveIn308 Wrote: I see no issue with holstered Concealed carry weapons on a range. If for any reason you would want to fire your concealed weapon I would think the proper way to do it is to unholster it on the firing line and handle it like any other fire arm you have on the firing line. And if in doubt ask the RSO how you should proceed.
Bristol treats shooters poorly with their silly 1 round rule. My solution is to NEVER go there, and encourage other shooters to do the same. If you are a into the shooting sports, you should not go to Bristol under any circumstances. And certainly don't join such a group. You have a choice in ranges, EXERCISE your right not to be treated POORLY.
I am not going to bother addressing the first part, I have spoken about that already. The second part do you know why there is a one bullet rule? It's due to bullets hitting a farmer's barn that is behind the hill. Muzzle rise and all. The big metal deflectors on the range are there to stop rounds as well. If you look you will see dings were they were shot. But I am sure that doesn't matter that farmer should love the fact his barn is shot right, since its all for the 2nd amendment.
Yea cause Bristol totally doesn't support the shooting sports, even though it's been a range open for about a century. Helping people develop their shotgun, rifle,pistol, black powder and archery. And hosting youth shooting events. I get it you are all team McMiller. And if you want to take your gun and go there, fine. But to actively try and talk people out if a close and cheap range due to your hang up on the rules, that is lame. It reminds me of people who want go into stores that allow CC. You either agree with me 100% or forget it. Since we have enough problems with moms demand action Bloomberg etc. Let's turn on groups who we agree 90% of the time. Since we don't like their safety rules.
I am done with this conversation, since its not going anywhere and I am done wasting my time.
As I mentioned in my post, it's to stop muzzle rise. And if you need to shoot at your target than stop and reload you won't have that rise. It's that simple. And yes hitting the barn would be a bug deal. So it makes sense to minimize the impact. But instead of making the best of it and getting good at reloading its better to just find fault. I am niot a fan if the rule but I understand it and make the best of it.
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - Dutz - 02-15-2015
(02-15-2015, 09:32 PM)fromtheplaines Wrote: make the best of it.
I make the best of it too, at McMiller's and OnTarget.
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - fromtheplaines - 02-15-2015
(02-10-2015, 09:08 AM)BelieveIn308 Wrote: So the range is really DESIGNED unsafe? The berm's are not high enough? Sure sounds like it to me.
You are free to support such a range. I prefer not too. Unsafe is unsafe, and it sounds like you are admitting the range is unsafe, PERIOD.
That is one thing that makes America great, people are FREE to go where they are treated with respect. There is competition out there. Go where you are treated well, and tell all those who will listen about bad experiences. Bristol always seemed less than safe, and I can see that is a correct assumption.
Once again, I recommend those interested in the shooting sports go elsewhere.
I am done with this conversation as well, as I am done wasting my time. Just like I am done with Bristol and their range Nazi'...
Yes since I totally said the range is unsafe. Arnt you guys just complaining that there are too many rules. So is it too many rules for you or too unsafe. If anything you are mad at some RO s treated you and you got a beef now.
That's fine, just don't dress it up as some protection of the 2nd.
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - fromtheplaines - 02-15-2015
[quote='BelieveIn308' pid='8872' dateline='1424036788'
I stand by my opinion, GO ELSEWHERE, don't spend a dime there, and ENCOURAGE everyone you know to AVOID it, if the value the Second Amendment.
[/quote]
Really? So I guess I don't support the second than. Gun owner for years, member if the nra, member of du, votes a straight NRA ticket. Guess I don't support the second since I go there.
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - fromtheplaines - 02-15-2015
(02-15-2015, 09:45 PM)Dutz Wrote:(02-15-2015, 09:32 PM)fromtheplaines Wrote: make the best of it.
I make the best of it too, at McMiller's and OnTarget.
Cool, I don't care if you shoot there. I would go to booth. I just don't agree with your reasons on Bristol
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - fromtheplaines - 02-15-2015
(02-10-2015, 09:10 AM)Dutz Wrote: That's too bad. I thought our discourse was rather civil for guys who carry guns.
I think the exchange of different ideas is helpful and more interesting than everyone agreeing and preaching to the choir all the time.
I assume, forgive me if I am wrong, you consider it a waste of time because you did not persuade. If so, just know real and effective persuasion rarely occurs until the persuaded has time to absorb and consider. If it does not take time and consideration the persuaded is generally just another sheep.
I don't mind debates I am just getting sick of the whole. You need to agree with me or your are not pro II. The rules in question are two separate things. The reason why I thought it was a waste of time. Is at best the points were pretty much disregarded. I know you don't like the rules. I don't like all of them either. I more or less tried to just explain the reason behind the rules to start this off. Some if the angst directed at the club makes it sound like a member ran over their dog and than backed over it fir good messure.
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - BelieveIn308 - 02-15-2015
(02-15-2015, 10:15 PM)fromtheplaines Wrote:(02-10-2015, 09:10 AM)Dutz Wrote: That's too bad. I thought our discourse was rather civil for guys who carry guns.
I think the exchange of different ideas is helpful and more interesting than everyone agreeing and preaching to the choir all the time.
I assume, forgive me if I am wrong, you consider it a waste of time because you did not persuade. If so, just know real and effective persuasion rarely occurs until the persuaded has time to absorb and consider. If it does not take time and consideration the persuaded is generally just another sheep.
I don't mind debates I am just getting sick of the whole. You need to agree with me or your are not pro II. The rules in question are two separate things. The reason why I thought it was a waste of time. Is at best the points were pretty much disregarded. I know you don't like the rules. I don't like all of them either. I more or less tried to just explain the reason behind the rules to start this off. Some if the angst directed at the club makes it sound like a member ran over their dog and than backed over it fir good messure.
You are entitled to your opinion. I am entitled to mine. That said, Bristol is the WORST range within 100 miles of where I live. You admit it is unsafe, the rules are idiotic, worse still the RSO's are Nazi's. Go there if you like, but I won't, and I will encourage every shooter I know to stay away.
No one said you were anti-Second, just that Bristol clearly is, that much just about everyone agrees on.
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - fromtheplaines - 02-15-2015
(02-15-2015, 10:23 PM)BelieveIn308 Wrote: You are entitled to your opinion. I am entitled to mine. That said, Bristol is the WORST range within 100 miles of where I live. You admit it is unsafe, the rules are idiotic, worse still the RSO's are Nazi's. Go there if you like, but I won't, and I will encourage every shooter I know to stay away.
No one said you were anti-Second, just that Bristol clearly is, that much just about everyone agrees on.
Don't put words in my mouth it's getting old.
And I guess everyone now means you and a few dudes. Your idea of anti second is odd. I thought it meant being against guns. Not being a gun range. But have few rules and BAM your Mikey Bloomberg
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - Freedoms1791 - 02-15-2015
(02-15-2015, 10:15 PM)fromtheplaines Wrote:(it sound like a member ran over their dog and than backed over it fir good messure. )(02-10-2015, 09:10 AM)Dutz Wrote: That's too bad. I thought our discourse was rather civil for guys who carry guns.
I think the exchange of different ideas is helpful and more interesting than everyone agreeing and preaching to the choir all the time.
I assume, forgive me if I am wrong, you consider it a waste of time because you did not persuade. If so, just know real and effective persuasion rarely occurs until the persuaded has time to absorb and consider. If it does not take time and consideration the persuaded is generally just another sheep.
I don't mind debates I am just getting sick of the whole. You need to agree with me or your are not pro II. The rules in question are two separate things. The reason why I thought it was a waste of time. Is at best the points were pretty much disregarded. I know you don't like the rules. I don't like all of them either. I more or less tried to just explain the reason behind the rules to start this off. Some if the angst directed at the club makes it sound like a member ran over their dog and than backed over it fir good messure.
No not the dog but close to the dog when they run over the 2A.
that kind of thinking is how we will be force to hand in are Ar's for single bolt action rifle. Or maybe the next new gun range will be told how to run there range and what rules they have to follow. I just don't understand how you can support a range that is anti 2A that's the part I don't get but I also don't understand how Obama won his second term. So don't think it can't happen. Ask the bar owner that pays $60,000 a year in taxes why he can't smoke in his own place. You don't have to agree with anyone just don't support anti 2A.
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - fromtheplaines - 02-15-2015
That is because they are not anti second. You just dont agree with them so you are labeling them anti. Is any one you don't agree with anti second? Right now that is the vibe I am getting.
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - fromtheplaines - 02-15-2015
Done for tonight I already typed through the first walking dead I am not going to miss the recap.
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - Freedoms1791 - 02-15-2015
when I can't carry in a gun range or any other place you bet that's Anti 2A you can call it the rules of the range but then what's about all the other place that's posted called? rules also Bull. If you spend money at Bristol you are supporting a Anti 2A business. Support Bristol help's Support Anti 2A
That would make for nice bumper sticker.
RE: GTR range in Waukegan - Freedoms1791 - 02-15-2015
(02-15-2015, 10:32 PM)fromtheplaines Wrote:(a few dudes) The Big Lebowski The Dude LMAO(02-15-2015, 10:23 PM)BelieveIn308 Wrote: You are entitled to your opinion. I am entitled to mine. That said, Bristol is the WORST range within 100 miles of where I live. You admit it is unsafe, the rules are idiotic, worse still the RSO's are Nazi's. Go there if you like, but I won't, and I will encourage every shooter I know to stay away.
No one said you were anti-Second, just that Bristol clearly is, that much just about everyone agrees on.
Don't put words in my mouth it's getting old.
And I guess everyone now means you and a few dudes. Your idea of anti second is odd. I thought it meant being against guns. Not being a gun range. But have few rules and BAM your Mikey Bloomberg