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01-25-2015, 05:45 PM,
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Gun accessory maker: 'Lazy' retail holds us back
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Crimson Trace thinks more retailers should be upselling their products right when a gun is sold but are not because the person behind the counter doesn't see lasers as necessary.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/102359715
I don't agree with Crimson Trace's premise. I get what they are saying, if you sell a gun then you should try to sell the traditional add-ons like additional magazines, cleaning supplies, etc., but lasers and optics are more like separate purchase decisions. Especially when you factor in the costs associated and people's preferences. Getting an extra magazine isn't the same decision as picking out a new scope.
I don't agree with Crimson Trace's premise. I get what they are saying, if you sell a gun then you should try to sell the traditional add-ons like additional magazines, cleaning supplies, etc., but lasers and optics are more like separate purchase decisions. Especially when you factor in the costs associated and people's preferences. Getting an extra magazine isn't the same decision as picking out a new scope.
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01-26-2015, 01:28 PM,
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RE: Gun accessory maker: 'Lazy' retail holds us back
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Maybe they should give us an incentive to sell there stuff.
It's very pricy product, and that would mean i would need a laser for each of the hundreds of guns we have.
It's very pricy product, and that would mean i would need a laser for each of the hundreds of guns we have.
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01-26-2015, 01:37 PM,
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RE: Gun accessory maker: 'Lazy' retail holds us back
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I have looked at Crimson in the past an although they seem to be nice, they are still kind of pricey. I for one don't like all the extra baggage on my weapon. I would agree that for my wife (who does not shoot often) a laser would be nice.
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01-26-2015, 02:42 PM,
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RE: Gun accessory maker: 'Lazy' retail holds us back
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I really don't see how this story helps them. This is usually the kind of whining you see in poor earnings reports for public companies, which I don't think they are.
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01-26-2015, 04:14 PM,
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RE: Gun accessory maker: 'Lazy' retail holds us back
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(01-26-2015, 02:42 PM)AcilletaM Wrote: I really don't see how this story helps them. This is usually the kind of whining you see in poor earnings reports for public companies, which I don't think they are.
I agree. From a corporate standpoint, my business is not growing like I want it to so lets see what excuses I can come up with and WHERE can I point the finger. Instead of looking at your margins and the fact that they maybe to HIGH? Maybe? Or my earnings report (EBITDA) is not where I had directed it to be so it must be someone else's fault.
Just sayn'
(01-26-2015, 02:42 PM)AcilletaM Wrote: I really don't see how this story helps them. This is usually the kind of whining you see in poor earnings reports for public companies, which I don't think they are.
I agree. From a corporate standpoint, my business is not growing like I want it to so lets see what excuses I can come up with and WHERE can I point the finger. Instead of looking at your margins and the fact that they maybe to HIGH? Maybe? Or my earnings report (EBITDA) is not where I had directed it to be so it must be someone else's fault.
Just sayn'
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01-26-2015, 08:00 PM,
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RE: Gun accessory maker: 'Lazy' retail holds us back
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(01-26-2015, 04:14 PM)bradberry Wrote: (01-26-2015, 02:42 PM)AcilletaM Wrote: I really don't see how this story helps them. This is usually the kind of whining you see in poor earnings reports for public companies, which I don't think they are.
I agree. From a corporate standpoint, my business is not growing like I want it to so lets see what excuses I can come up with and WHERE can I point the finger. Instead of looking at your margins and the fact that they maybe to HIGH? Maybe? Or my earnings report (EBITDA) is not where I had directed it to be so it must be someone else's fault.
Just sayn' 
(01-26-2015, 04:14 PM)bradberry Wrote: (01-26-2015, 02:42 PM)AcilletaM Wrote: I really don't see how this story helps them. This is usually the kind of whining you see in poor earnings reports for public companies, which I don't think they are.
I agree. From a corporate standpoint, my business is not growing like I want it to so lets see what excuses I can come up with and WHERE can I point the finger. Instead of looking at your margins and the fact that they maybe to HIGH? Maybe? Or my earnings report (EBITDA) is not where I had directed it to be so it must be someone else's fault.
Just sayn'
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01-26-2015, 09:48 PM,
(This post was last modified: 01-26-2015, 09:56 PM by AcilletaM.)
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RE: Gun accessory maker: 'Lazy' retail holds us back
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01-26-2015, 09:48 PM
(This post was last modified: 01-26-2015, 09:56 PM by AcilletaM.)
(01-26-2015, 04:14 PM)bradberry Wrote: (01-26-2015, 02:42 PM)AcilletaM Wrote: I really don't see how this story helps them. This is usually the kind of whining you see in poor earnings reports for public companies, which I don't think they are.
I agree. From a corporate standpoint, my business is not growing like I want it to so lets see what excuses I can come up with and WHERE can I point the finger. Instead of looking at your margins and the fact that they maybe to HIGH? Maybe? Or my earnings report (EBITDA) is not where I had directed it to be so it must be someone else's fault.
Just sayn'
This is typical in earnings calls when the company doesn't hit their numbers. Come April there will be people blaming winter weather, like that was something completely new. When it comes to metrics, most companies don't have great ones and try to read too much into the metrics they do use.
Crimson Traces' failure here isn't that they have lazy retailers - it is they are a lazy company. They have identified a problem area with their sales, be proactive and do something about it. To Mike's point, create incentives, create point-of-sale materials to increase product visibility, educate the consumer so they demand a CT laser when they get a new gun, etc. Calling out the sales people as lazy in a news article, that's barely lifting a finger to try to fix a problem. That's lazy.
(01-26-2015, 04:14 PM)bradberry Wrote: (01-26-2015, 02:42 PM)AcilletaM Wrote: I really don't see how this story helps them. This is usually the kind of whining you see in poor earnings reports for public companies, which I don't think they are.
I agree. From a corporate standpoint, my business is not growing like I want it to so lets see what excuses I can come up with and WHERE can I point the finger. Instead of looking at your margins and the fact that they maybe to HIGH? Maybe? Or my earnings report (EBITDA) is not where I had directed it to be so it must be someone else's fault.
Just sayn'
This is typical in earnings calls when the company doesn't hit their numbers. Come April there will be people blaming winter weather, like that was something completely new. When it comes to metrics, most companies don't have great ones and try to read too much into the metrics they do use.
Crimson Traces' failure here isn't that they have lazy retailers - it is they are a lazy company. They have identified a problem area with their sales, be proactive and do something about it. To Mike's point, create incentives, create point-of-sale materials to increase product visibility, educate the consumer so they demand a CT laser when they get a new gun, etc. Calling out the sales people as lazy in a news article, that's barely lifting a finger to try to fix a problem. That's lazy.
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01-26-2015, 10:05 PM,
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RE: Gun accessory maker: 'Lazy' retail holds us back
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It's kind of a turn off for me.
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01-26-2015, 10:45 PM,
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RE: Gun accessory maker: 'Lazy' retail holds us back
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I hate up selling techniques.
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01-27-2015, 01:16 PM,
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RE: Gun accessory maker: 'Lazy' retail holds us back
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I have spent many years in retail and I honestly understand the upsell component of it. With this instance I understand the frustration but I believe that he is going about it the entirely wrong way. Unfortunately we are living in a world where a large majority of people do not have a lot of disposable income so a purchase like a new handgun to many is a big purchase. A big enough purchase that afterwards enough money is usually not available for a laser when standing at the counter finalizing the transaction. I see wonderful upsell items for a handgun being items like ammo, lock, case/range bag, cleaning kit, etc... all items that one even with limited funds can usually purchase on a whim even if originally didn't plan on. I think Crimson needs to take a step back and look at the shopping history of people. I think attempts need to be made a month to 3 after a firearm was purchased to reengage with the customer and now attempt to make that sale. I know for myself I am not going to hold off purchasing a handgun an extra month or so just so I can purchase the laser at the same time. I want the gun now! I also know from a salesman standpoint most a driven to make a sale. Any incentive that can be given to sales staff to push the products always help!
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01-28-2015, 09:37 AM,
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RE: Gun accessory maker: 'Lazy' retail holds us back
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(01-27-2015, 01:16 PM)jfergus7 Wrote: I have spent many years in retail and I honestly understand the upsell component of it.
Crimson Trace does not understand it.
I spent 15 years managing retail commission salesmen and made their lives much easier teaching them the upsell effort rule.
The upsell effort rule: It takes the same effort to increase a sale 10% no matter what the cost.
If you sell a $60 range bag it takes certain effort to sell $6 ear plugs.
If you sell a $600 gun it takes the same effort to sell a $60 range bag as an add on as did the $6 ear plugs.
What made their lives easier is they learned if they stayed with their $600 customer they could sell a $60 range bag with significantly less effort as when they left their $600 customer at the counter to run grab a new customer only to sell that new customer a $60 range bag with a lot more effort.
What Crimson Trace does not understand is once you approach 30% it is now a new sale in regards to effort. A $200 laser is NOT an upsell on a $600 gun. It is on a $2000 gun.
If Crimson Trace expects to increase their sales by using upsell techniques and call salesmen lazy when that does not work they will fail.
(01-27-2015, 01:16 PM)jfergus7 Wrote: I have spent many years in retail and I honestly understand the upsell component of it.
Crimson Trace does not understand it.
I spent 15 years managing retail commission salesmen and made their lives much easier teaching them the upsell effort rule.
The upsell effort rule: It takes the same effort to increase a sale 10% no matter what the cost.
If you sell a $60 range bag it takes certain effort to sell $6 ear plugs.
If you sell a $600 gun it takes the same effort to sell a $60 range bag as an add on as did the $6 ear plugs.
What made their lives easier is they learned if they stayed with their $600 customer they could sell a $60 range bag with significantly less effort as when they left their $600 customer at the counter to run grab a new customer only to sell that new customer a $60 range bag with a lot more effort.
What Crimson Trace does not understand is once you approach 30% it is now a new sale in regards to effort. A $200 laser is NOT an upsell on a $600 gun. It is on a $2000 gun.
If Crimson Trace expects to increase their sales by using upsell techniques and call salesmen lazy when that does not work they will fail.
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01-31-2015, 01:48 PM,
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RE: Gun accessory maker: 'Lazy' retail holds us back
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Having never worked in a gun shop, would it be worth the investment for those that have an indoor/outdoor range to add laser products to the rental firearms? This may help a customer decide if they'd want a laser on a handgun.
Ric
Ric
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01-31-2015, 03:13 PM,
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RE: Gun accessory maker: 'Lazy' retail holds us back
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I guess selling really has changed from years ago. If you sell a new handgun, try to sell some obvious add on's. If they buy a new Glock that comes with 2 magazines, offer to sell them two additional ones at a discount. Ask the customer if he would like an Ammo sampler pack at a special price (mix 6 different brands (and include a box of RDA in the pack) with a gun purchase. Selling a rifle? Offer up a sling at a discount.
But work with the customer, you'd be surprised that most are pretty smart.
I think trying to sell a lazer at gun purchase time is pressing it. CT is needs to get into the real world of a gunshop and see what the CUSTOMER wants. Most people are not willing to pay premium prices for a lazer sight. Heck the one on the flashlight I have I never use. If they want to sell more, they need to provide incentives...
"An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it." -Col. Jeff Cooper
But work with the customer, you'd be surprised that most are pretty smart.
I think trying to sell a lazer at gun purchase time is pressing it. CT is needs to get into the real world of a gunshop and see what the CUSTOMER wants. Most people are not willing to pay premium prices for a lazer sight. Heck the one on the flashlight I have I never use. If they want to sell more, they need to provide incentives...
"An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it." -Col. Jeff Cooper
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01-31-2015, 03:52 PM,
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RE: Gun accessory maker: 'Lazy' retail holds us back
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At Red Dot, we'd rather you spend your money on some training to use the gun safety/correctly then actually buy some toy that is really a distraction.
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01-31-2015, 06:04 PM,
(This post was last modified: 01-31-2015, 06:05 PM by rwhite135.)
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01-31-2015, 06:04 PM
(This post was last modified: 01-31-2015, 06:05 PM by rwhite135.)
One thing laser sights have an ability to do is give away your position in a firefight. Play a couple rounds of multiplayer on Battlefield 4 and you'll see exactly what I mean. Yes, I know it's just a game but the principle is sound.
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01-31-2015, 06:20 PM,
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RE: Gun accessory maker: 'Lazy' retail holds us back
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(01-31-2015, 03:52 PM)mikereddot Wrote: At Red Dot, we'd rather you spend your money on some training to use the gun safety/correctly then actually buy some toy that is really a distraction.
I could not agree more. More training and the only thing you need is the weapon. Let the training kick in when the time arises.
After shooting in a few IDPA's you learn real quick..train...train..train..
(01-31-2015, 03:52 PM)mikereddot Wrote: At Red Dot, we'd rather you spend your money on some training to use the gun safety/correctly then actually buy some toy that is really a distraction.
I could not agree more. More training and the only thing you need is the weapon. Let the training kick in when the time arises.
After shooting in a few IDPA's you learn real quick..train...train..train..
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02-01-2015, 12:44 PM,
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RE: Gun accessory maker: 'Lazy' retail holds us back
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And let's not forget, that in Chicago Lazer sights are illegal. That will have an effect on demand too...
"An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it." -Col. Jeff Cooper
"An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it." -Col. Jeff Cooper
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02-01-2015, 01:02 PM,
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RE: Gun accessory maker: 'Lazy' retail holds us back
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(02-01-2015, 12:44 PM)BelieveIn308 Wrote: And let's not forget, that in Chicago Lazer sights are illegal. That will have an effect on demand too...
Did not know that. My son and I had this conversation yesterday as we were washing his truck. His comment was "Hey, then reduce the price a little. I mean I know you guys have a good product but it does carry a heavy price tag, especially as you are laying out cash for that new gun"
(02-01-2015, 12:44 PM)BelieveIn308 Wrote: And let's not forget, that in Chicago Lazer sights are illegal. That will have an effect on demand too...
Did not know that. My son and I had this conversation yesterday as we were washing his truck. His comment was "Hey, then reduce the price a little. I mean I know you guys have a good product but it does carry a heavy price tag, especially as you are laying out cash for that new gun"
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