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Are guns really the awnswer?
10-17-2014, 07:56 PM
Post: #21
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
When our Founding Fathers were writing the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, the 2nd most important thing in their minds were to guarantee our rights to bearing arms to protect ourselves.

Think about that for a minute.

The second most important thing to them. Right after freedom of speech.
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10-17-2014, 08:03 PM
Post: #22
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
Yeah, but....times where different then. They had just fought a war, of course they wanted to keep their guns. Now, with the best army in the world, we don't need a bunch of farmer to keep use safe.
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10-17-2014, 08:08 PM
Post: #23
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
You really think we have the best army in the world? Not in the least. If China were to really get serious and decide they didn't want to play nicely with us anymore they could put us in a world of hurt in a hurry. By shear numbers they could make it happen. And if that ever did happen you would be thankful that there are gun owners here and I'm sure you would want those of us who own guns to be profiicient with them.
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10-17-2014, 08:19 PM
Post: #24
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
Yeah, they have lots of people, but they have no fire power. Our Abram tanks can handle a bunch of them. They'd need to truck all those bodies here, not going to happen.
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10-17-2014, 08:25 PM
Post: #25
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
You think they couldn't get troops over here? Let's hope we never find out the answer to that question. Also, saying the Chinese have no firepower is extremely inaccurate and naive to say the least.

Exactly what is your reason for being here? To make yourself feel better knowing that you're above all of us gun nuts? Not trying to pick a fight or belittle but I do wonder why you're here. There isn't anything we can say to convince you that we deserve our right to gun ownership, and we already know that there is nothing you can say to convince us to give them up. So what is really the point of being here for you?
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10-17-2014, 08:56 PM
Post: #26
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
Once again, Firearms are not the problem. The Swiss are issued 2 weapon, one FULL Auto BTW, when they reach adulthood, yet they had ZERO murders by gun last year. Why is that? The problem you mention is the CULTURE of violence of the democrats. Gun violence in America is almost an exclusively democrat problem. Look at all the mass shooters. The shooting problem is usually democrats shooting other democrats, or robbing working people. These are CULTURAL issues. Perhaps we need to disarm anyone that votes democrat? Since 88% of the criminals are democrats, this seems most logical doesn't it. Don't allow democrats to own guns, and the crime rate drops like a stone.

"An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it." -Col. Jeff Cooper
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10-20-2014, 07:32 AM
Post: #27
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
What you're missing Peace is the fundamental principle of individual liberty. We live in a constitutional republic, not a democracy. The majority does not rule. The majority is required to honor first the rights of the individual.

Why? Slavery. Not whites owning black men in 19th century America. That was the shortest and most insignificant span of slavery in human history. Look at the Jews in ancient Egypt, 400 years int that condition. We can go on and on throughout history until today across the modern world.

This has been the condition of man since Cain slew Able. The strong prey on the week. If you think we are immune here you are mistaken. Rome had a republic for twice as long as we have and yet Caesar crossed the Rubicon.

Do you know what that meant, crossing the Rubicon?

The Rubicon was a river that had to be crossed to enter Rome. Rome had no army. Army's were created and financed by individuals. To maintain the Republic no man was allowed to bring his army across the Rubicon into Rome. No man did for 500 years, until Caesar.

And when he did there was nothing to stop him.

And why was that? Because the people were not armed? Of course not. The Roman armies could not be defeated by civilians no matter what arms they had.

There was no one to stop them because the people left the defense of their liberties to others. They had no heart. The soldiers were paid and went because they were paid.

Our republic stands because we volunteer. We sacrifice our lives and time to defend our own. We grow up visiting the graves of those who went before. And we remember. We always remember.

We own guns not to battle armies and exercise rights. We own guns because it is our responsibility to own them. The responsibility we owe first to the those who lie in the graves we visit.

What does slavery have to do with it? What separates a slave from a free man is the right to own firearms.

We have a responsibility not to be slaves, not to lose the liberty paid for by the blood of our fathers. We own guns not to forget.
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10-20-2014, 07:37 AM
Post: #28
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
very well said Dan. Thx.
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10-20-2014, 07:55 AM (This post was last modified: 10-20-2014 07:55 AM by BelieveIn308.)
Post: #29
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
Excellent response. And I remind people it was the democrats that started the last civil war fighting FOR slavery. And after the Civil War the democrats founded the KKK! These are both FACTS. What say you Peace?

Dan, well said! You're are more of a statesmen than I will ever be.

"An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it." -Col. Jeff Cooper
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10-20-2014, 02:02 PM
Post: #30
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
good post, Dan!

"Gun control is like trying to reduce drunk driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars."

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10-24-2014, 01:25 PM (This post was last modified: 10-24-2014 04:08 PM by Brian S.)
Post: #31
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
(10-17-2014 08:03 PM)PieceLessPeace Wrote:  Yeah, but....times where different then. They had just fought a war, of course they wanted to keep their guns. Now, with the best army in the world, we don't need a bunch of farmer to keep use safe.

Are we not at war now?

Yes we may have the greatest military in the world however our military is spread throughout the world. I'm sure the country remains well protected from invasions by air or sea but not by land anymore.
Is our military prepared to protect us against terrorist attacks in an urban warfare situation?

I don't feel our military or government is prepared to protect me if the fight comes to the our soil, concrete, steel or blacktop.

I'm proud of the country that my dad and uncles fought for in WWII on foreign soil. But today's war is much different. I feel the fight is beginning to come to my soil, I don't feel our military has the capability to protect me 24x7, I also don't expect other countries to help fight a war on our soil....I'm going to be prepared to protect myself.

Click Here ~~~~>Glock Often Imitated....Never Duplicated
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11-06-2014, 07:54 AM
Post: #32
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
I think PeaceLessPeace is probably suffering a complete breakdown, after the People, NRA and supporters of the Second Amendment CRUSHED the gun grabbing democrats in the election.

"An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it." -Col. Jeff Cooper
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11-10-2014, 10:21 PM
Post: #33
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
(11-06-2014 07:54 AM)BelieveIn308 Wrote:  I think PeaceLessPeace is probably suffering a complete breakdown, after the People, NRA and supporters of the Second Amendment CRUSHED the gun grabbing democrats in the election.

Thumbs up

"Gun control is like trying to reduce drunk driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars."

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11-19-2014, 03:51 PM
Post: #34
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
Well....all those previous replies were excellent. When I recall why I own, I go through various reasons, but ultimately gravitate towards the one core reason: keeping the USA free. I'm a movie freak, and I often think about the first Red Dawn movie, where the US was attacked and occupied; our military was unable cover all our real estate. As improbable as that scenario is, I was shocked to see scenes where civilians were rounded up and either imprisoned, used as political weapons, or simply shot. We see this every day in the news in Iraq, Syria and in Africa. This crap never will cease to exist and resting on our laurels here in the States is not wise. There's a more obscure Australian film, more recent, that depicts a "north korea" invasion of their country. Most people had no guns, but there were a few -- hence the plot of the movie. Even Hermann Goering stated "they'll never bomb this place" (sometimes to humorous reply). People believe what their governments tell them; and often they are wrong. Just my two cents....
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11-19-2014, 06:09 PM (This post was last modified: 11-19-2014 06:10 PM by BelieveIn308.)
Post: #35
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
The reason behind the Second Amendment had zero to do with self defense against criminals or hunting. It was placed in the Constitution so that the people could have a fighting chance against a tyrannical government. Anyone that doubts this needs to read Madison, Mason and Jefferson. There was no doubt in the founding fathers minds, that this was the ultimate guaranty of our liberty and freedom. Let us not forget that. As Danton said, "Man has the rights he can defend"!

"An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it." -Col. Jeff Cooper
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12-02-2014, 02:55 PM
Post: #36
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
(09-16-2014 08:25 PM)BelieveIn308 Wrote:  
(09-16-2014 08:02 PM)PieceLessPeace Wrote:  Thanks for letting me join this Forum.

I don't not believe guns are needed for peace, but I'm hopping to learn from y'all and we can find a happy medium.

I'm really curious why 'gun lovers' are so bent of these tools of destruction.

We believe guns would not be needed, if only others didn't believe in using force to make someone else pay their way (Socialism/Communism).

We believe force is needed to preserve RIGHTS granted under the Constitution, as the government seems to believe they can take away whatever rights they want to enforce their will and control others.

We believe the criminal element will always have weapons, unless you can outlaw knowledge to produce such weapons.

We have learned from history that a disarmed people are slaves. As Danton said "Man has the Rights he can Defend".

One only look at the current dictator Obama. A man that clearly doesn't believe in law. A man that doesn't believe in rights. A man that believes he can ignore laws he doesn't agree with.

There is a great quote on this website: This year will go down in history. For the first time, a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer, our police will be more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future! Adolph Hitler, 1935 How did that work out for you? How about those under Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao, or a host of other gun control socialist/communist murderers?

(09-23-2014 09:58 AM)PieceLessPeace Wrote:  
(09-18-2014 06:24 PM)RJDSRT Wrote:  PieceLessPeace, First of all, welcome to the forum! Secondly, I would like to invite you to accompany me to the range some time. I will supply a few guns and ammunition and I will cover your range fee. It helps to understand the sport by getting out and trying it. Send me a message if you are interested in going, I bet you will have a fantastic time!

-Ryan

I'm sorry, but I have no interest at this time to shoot firearms. Thanks anyways.

No offense but your refusal to not try the tools that your so against is disheartening. You are against something that you nether know how to use or even understand. Intellectual honesty is a very rare. You would be taken more seriously if you had a sounder foundation from which you speak.
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01-14-2015, 09:08 AM (This post was last modified: 01-14-2015 09:13 AM by rwhite135.)
Post: #37
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
I find the following quote to be pretty self explanatory as well. It is much more recent than the ones from the Founders but embraces the same philosophy:

“The conclusion is thus inescapable that the history, concept, and wording of the second amendment to the Constitution of the United States, as well as its interpretation by every major commentator and court in the first half-century after its ratification, indicates that what is protected is an individual right of a private citizen to own and carry firearms in a peaceful manner.”-- Report of the Subcommittee On The Constitution of the Committee On The Judiciary, United States Senate, 97th Congress, second session (February, 1982), SuDoc# Y4.J 89/2: Ar 5/5

I find it amazing how in less than 30 years the left in this country has tried to completely reverse course on that finding of the U.S. Senate. I also like this supposed quote from Japanese Supreme Military Commander Admiral Yamamoto during WWII, "You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass."

As for the assertion that European countries are not tyrannical after gun bans, if you think that paying 70%+ of your wages to the national government, in the form of taxes, isn't tyrannical then you are a fool. As one woman told Oprah, when she and the Obamas tried pitching Chicago to the Olympic Committee, "What stuff? We can't afford stuff." The reason she couldn't was because of the insane taxes she had to pay. If you want to talk about tyranny in the U.K., I think having to have a license to watch television qualifies, as does paying close to $10 a gallon for gas due to taxation. I personally know a couple in the U.K. who had to sell their pub/inn due to not being able to afford the tyrannical taxation over there.
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01-14-2015, 10:18 AM
Post: #38
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
(11-19-2014 06:09 PM)BelieveIn308 Wrote:  The reason behind the Second Amendment had zero to do with self defense against criminals or hunting. It was placed in the Constitution so that the people could have a fighting chance against a tyrannical government. Anyone that doubts this needs to read Madison, Mason and Jefferson. There was no doubt in the founding fathers minds, that this was the ultimate guaranty of our liberty and freedom. Let us not forget that. As Danton said, "Man has the rights he can defend"!

Very well put and of course something that is very important is that I am sure PieceLessPeace loves his first amendment, but it is meaningless without the 2nd amendment to back it up. How else does a nation stay free. There are too many attacks on ALL CIVIL LIBERTIES from within. As politicians push for power they then erode all of our civil liberties, and as they do that the 2nd is in place to stop them. The words above, "Tyranny and Oppression" need to be clearly stated and are very important as we are now closer than ever to an Oligarchy. Just my two cents.....WHY because I LOVE MY FREEDOM.......
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01-14-2015, 02:19 PM
Post: #39
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
(01-14-2015 10:18 AM)bradberry Wrote:  
(11-19-2014 06:09 PM)BelieveIn308 Wrote:  The reason behind the Second Amendment had zero to do with self defense against criminals or hunting. It was placed in the Constitution so that the people could have a fighting chance against a tyrannical government. Anyone that doubts this needs to read Madison, Mason and Jefferson. There was no doubt in the founding fathers minds, that this was the ultimate guaranty of our liberty and freedom. Let us not forget that. As Danton said, "Man has the rights he can defend"!

Very well put and of course something that is very important is that I am sure PieceLessPeace loves his first amendment, but it is meaningless without the 2nd amendment to back it up. How else does a nation stay free. There are too many attacks on ALL CIVIL LIBERTIES from within. As politicians push for power they then erode all of our civil liberties, and as they do that the 2nd is in place to stop them. The words above, "Tyranny and Oppression" need to be clearly stated and are very important as we are now closer than ever to an Oligarchy. Just my two cents.....WHY because I LOVE MY FREEDOM.......
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01-14-2015, 05:39 PM
Post: #40
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RE: Are guns really the awnswer?
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(01-14-2015 02:19 PM)Freedoms1791 Wrote:  
(01-14-2015 10:18 AM)bradberry Wrote:  
(11-19-2014 06:09 PM)BelieveIn308 Wrote:  The reason behind the Second Amendment had zero to do with self defense against criminals or hunting. It was placed in the Constitution so that the people could have a fighting chance against a tyrannical government. Anyone that doubts this needs to read Madison, Mason and Jefferson. There was no doubt in the founding fathers minds, that this was the ultimate guaranty of our liberty and freedom. Let us not forget that. As Danton said, "Man has the rights he can defend"!

Very well put and of course something that is very important is that I am sure PieceLessPeace loves his first amendment, but it is meaningless without the 2nd amendment to back it up. How else does a nation stay free. There are too many attacks on ALL CIVIL LIBERTIES from within. As politicians push for power they then erode all of our civil liberties, and as they do that the 2nd is in place to stop them. The words above, "Tyranny and Oppression" need to be clearly stated and are very important as we are now closer than ever to an Oligarchy. Just my .two cents.....WHY because I LOVE MY FREEDOM.......
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ThumbupThumbup it all comes down to being open to share both sides of the debate. Peace was willing to use his first amendment right as a TOOL, but not willing to learn what the TOOLS of the second amendment are about. Try using the example that just happened in France. If all of those people had a firearm to protect themselves the outcome would have been completely different.
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